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	<title>Comments on: Authority, Trust, Devotion</title>
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	<link>http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2010/03/authority-trust-devotion/</link>
	<description>Discover the Emerging Face of Buddhism</description>
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		<title>By: Authority, Trust, Devotion &#124; Buddhist Geeks &#171; The Waterfront</title>
		<link>http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2010/03/authority-trust-devotion/comment-page-1/#comment-89</link>
		<dc:creator>Authority, Trust, Devotion &#124; Buddhist Geeks &#171; The Waterfront</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 10:29:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/?p=515#comment-89</guid>
		<description>[...] post about zazen: Authority, Trust, Devotion &#124; Buddhist Geeks.     Categories: Buddhism, Zafu Tags: Buddhist Geeks, Meditation, Zazen       Comments (0) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] post about zazen: Authority, Trust, Devotion | Buddhist Geeks.     Categories: Buddhism, Zafu Tags: Buddhist Geeks, Meditation, Zazen       Comments (0) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Duff McDuffee</title>
		<link>http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2010/03/authority-trust-devotion/comment-page-1/#comment-85</link>
		<dc:creator>Duff McDuffee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:06:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/?p=515#comment-85</guid>
		<description>Hokai is my secret guru! :) Thank you for this beautiful writing. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hokai is my secret guru! <img src='http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  Thank you for this beautiful writing.</p>
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		<title>By: Alec_S</title>
		<link>http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2010/03/authority-trust-devotion/comment-page-1/#comment-78</link>
		<dc:creator>Alec_S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 04:41:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/?p=515#comment-78</guid>
		<description>Hokai, 
 
I appreciate the thoughtful response. It is very helpful!  
 
The last bit, where you said &quot;...others won&#039;t settle for anything less than you reinventing your own path in the process&quot; was particularly powerful, and it&#039;s now a quote on my tumblr :D 
 
I look forward to hearing more from you in the future! </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hokai, </p>
<p>I appreciate the thoughtful response. It is very helpful!  </p>
<p>The last bit, where you said &quot;&#8230;others won&#039;t settle for anything less than you reinventing your own path in the process&quot; was particularly powerful, and it&#039;s now a quote on my tumblr <img src='http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>I look forward to hearing more from you in the future!</p>
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		<title>By: Hokai</title>
		<link>http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2010/03/authority-trust-devotion/comment-page-1/#comment-77</link>
		<dc:creator>Hokai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 20:05:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/?p=515#comment-77</guid>
		<description>Well, not that I can really comment on something in so general terms without missing what&#039;s crucial. You know, devil is in the details. What I can say is that, interpretation of teachings, through additional conceptual clarification, through experiential grasp in practice (both formal and post-meditation), and finally through integration in everyday activity - all these being &quot;interpretation&quot; in broad sense - is your responsibility, not your teachers&#039;. And you probably cannot allow yourself to interpret stuff in a way that ultimately won&#039;t make sense in the context of the life you&#039;re living day in day out, of your relationships with society and culture at large, and of your overall horizon.  
 
Certain practices can still be practiced literally in the context or in a time-frame of intensive practice, whether retreat or home-based. Outer forms still have a role to play, at least for some of us, like a stepping stone. A 100-day discipline may be pursued exactly according to received instructions, and then reviewed to see what comes out as essential, and what remains basically as just a formality, useful and perhaps improvable in days to come. We&#039;re in this together, it seems. Impermanence is relentless, especially when it comes to time-honored Dharmic formalisms. Going beyond them by not suppressing the vitality of one&#039;s actual experience with one&#039;s teachers is not an instance of disrespect, at least for the mind that is modern and beyond. To be honest, Buddhist practitioners have done such &quot;outrageous&quot; moves even in very rigid, traditional circumstances. Certainly some teachers these days would rather see a xerox of their own teaching, than a lifelike students&#039; authenticity that challenges everyone involved. Yet others won&#039;t settle for anything less than you reinventing your own path in the process. Hope this is helpful. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, not that I can really comment on something in so general terms without missing what&#039;s crucial. You know, devil is in the details. What I can say is that, interpretation of teachings, through additional conceptual clarification, through experiential grasp in practice (both formal and post-meditation), and finally through integration in everyday activity &#8211; all these being &quot;interpretation&quot; in broad sense &#8211; is your responsibility, not your teachers&#039;. And you probably cannot allow yourself to interpret stuff in a way that ultimately won&#039;t make sense in the context of the life you&#039;re living day in day out, of your relationships with society and culture at large, and of your overall horizon.  </p>
<p>Certain practices can still be practiced literally in the context or in a time-frame of intensive practice, whether retreat or home-based. Outer forms still have a role to play, at least for some of us, like a stepping stone. A 100-day discipline may be pursued exactly according to received instructions, and then reviewed to see what comes out as essential, and what remains basically as just a formality, useful and perhaps improvable in days to come. We&#039;re in this together, it seems. Impermanence is relentless, especially when it comes to time-honored Dharmic formalisms. Going beyond them by not suppressing the vitality of one&#039;s actual experience with one&#039;s teachers is not an instance of disrespect, at least for the mind that is modern and beyond. To be honest, Buddhist practitioners have done such &quot;outrageous&quot; moves even in very rigid, traditional circumstances. Certainly some teachers these days would rather see a xerox of their own teaching, than a lifelike students&#039; authenticity that challenges everyone involved. Yet others won&#039;t settle for anything less than you reinventing your own path in the process. Hope this is helpful.</p>
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		<title>By: Alec_S</title>
		<link>http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2010/03/authority-trust-devotion/comment-page-1/#comment-76</link>
		<dc:creator>Alec_S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 18:43:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/?p=515#comment-76</guid>
		<description>Hokai, 
 
Great answer!  For me personally, it brings up an interesting and challenging question. I understand that conceptually the outer, inner and secret levels are integrated, but for me, experientially they just don&#039;t fit together! I&#039;ve always felt weird about outer-level guru yoga and I&#039;ve always been torn between whether I&#039;m bad at it or it&#039;s just &quot;who I am&quot;. I can&#039;t do it like it says in the books because I can&#039;t think of my teachers as anything other than just really wise people. (Buddhas? Deities?) 
 
And then when I hear &quot;inner&quot; explanations like yours I feel so much more comfortable in that territory. But the quandary arrives when I hear teachers say &quot;don&#039;t invent your own path&quot; because I feel like, day to day, I rely almost exclusively on the sorts of things you wrote about, and not the things associated with traditional, outer guru yoga (like asking your teacher for advice on everything!). 
 
I have two teachers who I have great relationships with, and I&#039;ve learned a lot from them. I know deep down that the way these relationships turned out is right for me, but it doesn&#039;t stop my mind from playing tricks like, &quot;You have abandoned them because you don&#039;t meditate on them as being the Buddha EVERY day&quot; and all the practices about Guru Yoga in the Tibetan tradition that I studied.  
 
What do you think about it? I know it&#039;s kind of a tangent, but maybe it&#039;s interesting anyways? Is there some other factor that might help me understand this situation? Because it&#039;s been an ongoing question for me and your article made me think about it again, </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hokai, </p>
<p>Great answer!  For me personally, it brings up an interesting and challenging question. I understand that conceptually the outer, inner and secret levels are integrated, but for me, experientially they just don&#039;t fit together! I&#039;ve always felt weird about outer-level guru yoga and I&#039;ve always been torn between whether I&#039;m bad at it or it&#039;s just &quot;who I am&quot;. I can&#039;t do it like it says in the books because I can&#039;t think of my teachers as anything other than just really wise people. (Buddhas? Deities?) </p>
<p>And then when I hear &quot;inner&quot; explanations like yours I feel so much more comfortable in that territory. But the quandary arrives when I hear teachers say &quot;don&#039;t invent your own path&quot; because I feel like, day to day, I rely almost exclusively on the sorts of things you wrote about, and not the things associated with traditional, outer guru yoga (like asking your teacher for advice on everything!). </p>
<p>I have two teachers who I have great relationships with, and I&#039;ve learned a lot from them. I know deep down that the way these relationships turned out is right for me, but it doesn&#039;t stop my mind from playing tricks like, &quot;You have abandoned them because you don&#039;t meditate on them as being the Buddha EVERY day&quot; and all the practices about Guru Yoga in the Tibetan tradition that I studied.  </p>
<p>What do you think about it? I know it&#039;s kind of a tangent, but maybe it&#039;s interesting anyways? Is there some other factor that might help me understand this situation? Because it&#039;s been an ongoing question for me and your article made me think about it again,</p>
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		<title>By: Hokai</title>
		<link>http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2010/03/authority-trust-devotion/comment-page-1/#comment-75</link>
		<dc:creator>Hokai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 17:31:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/?p=515#comment-75</guid>
		<description>Hey Alec:) the perspective I&#039;ve chosen to present here is definitely post-traditional, but it allows full harmony with the guruyoga framework (and practices based on it). In most lineages that teach some form of guruyoga, it is recognized that guru-principle exists externally, internally, and secretly, i.e. on a scale of increasing subtlety and therefore increasing non-separation between the practitioner and the embodiment of awakening. Therefore, yoga (lit. union or oneness). Now, my discussion belongs mostly to the experiential inner level, but this does not preclude or exclude the outer meaning(s) of either authority, trust, or devotion. Moreover, any of these may be unpacked in various ways, depending on different meaning-making structures (traditional, modern, postmodern, and further), but I hope I&#039;ve left enough room for that. So basically, this is a hopefully novel and depth-exploring approach to the basics of just sitting, breathing, and being aware. Does it contradict what you may have learned before? Not in my view. Let me know if this covers your comment, thx:) </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Alec:) the perspective I&#039;ve chosen to present here is definitely post-traditional, but it allows full harmony with the guruyoga framework (and practices based on it). In most lineages that teach some form of guruyoga, it is recognized that guru-principle exists externally, internally, and secretly, i.e. on a scale of increasing subtlety and therefore increasing non-separation between the practitioner and the embodiment of awakening. Therefore, yoga (lit. union or oneness). Now, my discussion belongs mostly to the experiential inner level, but this does not preclude or exclude the outer meaning(s) of either authority, trust, or devotion. Moreover, any of these may be unpacked in various ways, depending on different meaning-making structures (traditional, modern, postmodern, and further), but I hope I&#039;ve left enough room for that. So basically, this is a hopefully novel and depth-exploring approach to the basics of just sitting, breathing, and being aware. Does it contradict what you may have learned before? Not in my view. Let me know if this covers your comment, thx:)</p>
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		<title>By: Alec_S</title>
		<link>http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2010/03/authority-trust-devotion/comment-page-1/#comment-72</link>
		<dc:creator>Alec_S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 16:06:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/?p=515#comment-72</guid>
		<description>Hokai, 
 
In most of the Buddhist settings I&#039;ve been in, discussion about authority, trust and devotion was always a Guru Yoga topic. 
 
But it seems like your definition of these three are talking about something else... 
 
Are you offering an alternative? That if we contemplate and develop &quot;inner&quot; authority, trust, devotion... this is better? Or is it just general practice advice? It&#039;s just that the title makes me think you are maybe saying, &quot;Real authority is this. Real devotion is this.&quot; and implicitly saying, &quot;And that other stuff that you&#039;ve heard about it, well it&#039;s good, but actually this is the real deal.&quot;  
  
Or maybe I&#039;m missing the overall point. I&#039;m just unclear what I am supposed to take from this :P </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hokai, </p>
<p>In most of the Buddhist settings I&#039;ve been in, discussion about authority, trust and devotion was always a Guru Yoga topic. </p>
<p>But it seems like your definition of these three are talking about something else&#8230; </p>
<p>Are you offering an alternative? That if we contemplate and develop &quot;inner&quot; authority, trust, devotion&#8230; this is better? Or is it just general practice advice? It&#039;s just that the title makes me think you are maybe saying, &quot;Real authority is this. Real devotion is this.&quot; and implicitly saying, &quot;And that other stuff that you&#039;ve heard about it, well it&#039;s good, but actually this is the real deal.&quot;  </p>
<p>Or maybe I&#039;m missing the overall point. I&#039;m just unclear what I am supposed to take from this <img src='http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_razz.gif' alt=':P' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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